Curse

Jetdoc · Oct 27, 2006, 06:26 PM // 18:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

I would penalize players for bringing henchmen/heroes and only give the boosted drops for a FULL party of PARTICIPATING players.

With the brand-spankin' new introduction of Heroes, do you think that A-Net would actually penalize someone for using them?

Vel Satis · Oct 27, 2006, 06:33 PM // 18:33

/kind of signed

I'd do it the other way though. Keep the drops the same and simulate the extra players in a party less than max size so that every player, no matter the size of the party they were in, gets the same drops as if they were in a party of max size for that area.

Cherrie · Oct 27, 2006, 06:39 PM // 18:39

Im not really sure if im for or against your idea
Defenetly, players need more gold income w/o being forced to farm - for Gods' sake, there are SO many skills in now, and even if someone decides to play only one character, he has heroes to get skills for now too (I mean stricte PvE players like me). Yes I farmed, but I never spend my money on fancy skin weapons or armors, just on skills for my 3 characters. There simply ain't enough gold an average player can gather now, when all skills have to be bought at vendors. So.... I guess threadmaker's idea is better than what ANet is serving us

/signed
for bringing more gold into the market

Cherrie · Oct 27, 2006, 06:43 PM // 18:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetdoc

With the brand-spankin' new introduction of Heroes, do you think that A-Net would actually penalize someone for using them?

I like the idea of more AND better drops for full parties, but I wouldnt say "only full ppl parties" - it's really hard to get a monk, so I'd say, partysize -1 or -2 so people can take some henchies if noone around seems to fancy farming. In low lvl areas partysize is smaller so it might me 50-50 real ppl and hench, but than again who farms in 4 slot party areas.

Helios Skyfire · Oct 27, 2006, 07:21 PM // 19:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cherrie

There simply ain't enough gold an average player can gather now, when all skills have to be bought at vendors.

Since when do "all skills have to be bought at vendors"??

Sim Hae · Oct 27, 2006, 07:46 PM // 19:46

No matter how you look at it, one will always have to farm solo or in team to make money. Gold that will drop will not bring you much money but selling wapons or upgrades can get you alot of it.

As for solo farming:
I say - respect, for those who can do it. Some people like to do it besides almost everything can be soloed, hard places like fow,uw,titans,sf..or simple like farming totem axe,sskai... That meens that entire game would have to be nerfed, now thats a lot of work, and there will always be a way to farm solo. But on the other hand if you want more money, or just want to farm with more people, well that could be solved with a simple solution. There could be more places to farm like for exe. sorows furnance where would be alot of gold or green items or perhaps even alot of materials to find there.

This game needs more places to make money not money itself or nerf or whateva..

Robin_Anadri · Oct 27, 2006, 08:13 PM // 20:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Helios Skyfire

Since when do "all skills have to be bought at vendors"??

Since Factions. If you want to be pedantic, there is a very small subset of skills that you can obtain by doing some Shing Jea questing, around picking your secondary profession.

This is vastly different from Prophecies, when you could obtain all kinds of skills from doing quests. It was quite feasible to never spend a skill point, because you could obtain everything you needed from skill questing.

If you're referring to Balthazar faction unlocks, that's all well and good for PvP characters, but PvP characters don't need gold - we're talking about PvE characters. Unlocks do you no good if the skill is not in your list, which it won't be until you purchase it from a skill trainer.

Sadly, it seems Nightfall is following this same example. At least they're not making us buy skills for Heroes.

Iscana · Oct 27, 2006, 08:28 PM // 20:28

/not signed

Farming is something I did because I just couldn't afford a load of things. Before I farmed I played GW until a few months afther Factions since I had Prophecies. I never found 1 black dye nor a green and just a few golds, and my gold didn't came higher then just a few k with doing the normal storyline play as well discovering.

Since I'm farming I can afford a loads of things, minipet for fun, green weapons, 15k armor for chars and I was also farming for FoW Ritualist armor which you just can't afford without farming anything. Now the stuff has been changed I still can farm, but it just takes longer, althought I found a few ways to farm the old fassion way with agro'ing loads of enemies, I just have to avoid a certain combo. But anyways, without farming I think I stopped playing GW because I simply couldn't afford anything I wanted, now I can. Since I have loads of platinum I also like to help out another people out of money problems, which what I think nobody could do without farming.

MegaMouse · Oct 28, 2006, 04:29 PM // 16:29

Personaly I think that they need to change the drop rate. Make the rate the same even if you go at it solo or with a team. This might make the gold farmers tihnk twice about doing that, and it may even stabilize the game economy. As far as farmers stopping that may never happen, but they can make it harder for farmers to get the amount of gold they used to and even the number of items also.
As far as the 15k armor goes I have only 2 sets beteen 2 accounts. Its not that I dont want it but I think that the stats ought to be better for me to spend that kind of gold to get new armor. I always look at the stas before making any decission on any weapon or armor. If the new weapon or armor has better stats then I think that it is worth it. Spending 15k on armor that has the same stats is not something that I will do and I suggest that everyone do the same. Looks arn't everything.

Mega Mouse

Celestial Shaman · Oct 28, 2006, 04:40 PM // 16:40

/signed

You can't have a game like this without having some form of farming and with prices for basic things as high as they are. Making it so each person has there own drops, with others invisible would probably work, but i think people are still going to want some way to farm.

actionjack · Oct 28, 2006, 05:02 PM // 17:02

I have mix opinion about such evenly distributed gold mechanics.

While I do think forcing player to farm is a filler for true game play content, I do farm from time to time, and not just because I want to buy the expensive stuff.

I think the high end stuff were put there as a teasing goal, not a necessarity, but a luxury good to encourage player to further play on. So the price can be understandbly high (but with the recent anti-farming mob AI, I think that price might need to be lower)

Back on the issue. One major problem would be the leechers, who would just afk. Another is team farming, where just have 1 person do the farming, dragging 7 additional afkers with him, to gain the 7X the gold. Those are 2 very fatal problems. Also it discourage better reward with greater challenge (lesser player in team mean will be harder).

Few ways of making gold-making more team-orientated would be
1) Decrease the Anti-farming code when with a team
2) Make Farming Harder (already see with change-mob AI)
3) Make it easier to cordernate a team (Heros help on that)
4) Make certain assign drop worth more (so a mob-drop can sell for more than just 30g) That way it help distribute out the gold.
5) Increase gold drop by mob depend on how many are in the group. (say +10% more gold for every person)
6) Similar to above. Not necessary make it drop 8 items if have a 8-men team, but just have higher chance of dropping double drop, or tripple/quatro drop (from bosses) when have a full group of people on team.
7) Devalue Gold (that is another topic of its own)

Solar_Takfar · Oct 28, 2006, 10:05 PM // 22:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr_Cynical

I mean the stuff sold by ingame NPCs - FoW, 15k, even 'basic' max armor costs 7.5k per char, which is not trivial to acquire unless you farm.

Now here's where you are wrong. Just play thru the game, do all the quests and missions, etc, and don't waste gold: it's pretty much guaranteed you will have a full set of 1.5k armor AND a nice cache of 20k to 30k gold stored once you finish. If you take that char to another continent and finish that too, you'll have more than enough gold to buy a full set of 15k armor and a fair share of skills.

Franco · Oct 28, 2006, 10:22 PM // 22:22

/not signed

jesus christ, another "give me everything the easy way" thread, go work for it.

Not A Fifty Five · Oct 29, 2006, 12:46 AM // 00:46

Well that's not what the gripe is franco. We're just saying anet wanted farming as a team not solo farming (the anti-farm nerf just showed that) and this would simply solve that problem. And whoever said you'd have enough money for full droks etc after making your first char thats quite wrong, I ended up beating the lich with lions arch armor >.<

Sim Hae · Oct 29, 2006, 11:05 AM // 11:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Not A Fifty Five

Well that's not what the gripe is franco. We're just saying anet wanted farming as a team not solo farming (the anti-farm nerf just showed that) and this would simply solve that problem. And whoever said you'd have enough money for full droks etc after making your first char thats quite wrong, I ended up beating the lich with lions arch armor >.<

You killed lich with lions arch armor?? Riiiiiight!

Quid Pro Quo · Oct 29, 2006, 11:13 AM // 11:13

/partlysigned

I think everyone getting all the gold would be good but not all the drops.

If people want to pay EVEN MORE because of this then so be it but alteast other people will be able to buy required items.

MegaMouse · Oct 29, 2006, 03:30 PM // 15:30

What I see here is a few players who will farm for a few good item, and then those who condone farming totaly. I admit I go out and farm whenI am looking for a certian weapon or need some gold. Making the gold drop seperatly for each person is not how to solve the problem. Like I said earlier in this thread but my have been misunderstood and I want to clear up a few things that I may have interpeted wrong. First: make all the drops equal to the total number of allowed team members, certian areas only allow 4, 6 or 8 players depending on where you are, so set t so the drops will be the same whether you have 1 or the max number of players for the area, Basicaly killing solo farming. Leave the amount of gold droped alone, if it is increased it may destabilize the in-gam economy and we do not want that, who will be willing to pay 30k for a piece of armor when everyone now has the max amount of gold. Also reward players for having a team made up of opther players by giving them an incentive to do so. At the moment gold dops are rare when someone is with henchies, so have them drop more when a max number team of players is in an area.
The game economy is destabilized enough without making it worse. The currenttrade system is broken and needs a major overhaul. But that is another thread and I will not get into it here.
My point is get rid of the farmers especialy the bot farmers in the desert and other high lvl areas. Then work on fixing the trade system to one that is more fair for all.

Mega Mouse

Blightfire · Oct 29, 2006, 03:56 PM // 15:56

It won't really help, even if you farm solo its still farming.. lets put it this way: I can farm solo, or i can farm in a group, if both are of equal drop rates it doesn't really matter which i choose, chances are there'd be enough people to group with and they'd just farm together.. how does that solve the farming problem? nice try though:
oh, another thing, i don't see why people should be so obessed with farmers.. the whole point of GW is not to give players an advantage even if they rich the point of having too much money...
lets put it this way: a max stat chaos axe 15^50 with a low req and a victo axe.. you can get the victo axe cheap and spend 100k~ for the chaos axe... its really just for owning the chaos axe, doesn't make you anymuch stronger...
/notsigned

freekedoutfish · Oct 29, 2006, 03:57 PM // 15:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

Higher prices to what? weapons? "High end" weapons are just regular weapons but look prettier. You and I both know they are just for vanity. Who cares if they cost a lot?

So what if a crystalline costs 100000000000000000? Does that affect the average player?

Look at the influx of greens. Good stats for cheap.

I think we need some GOOD solid data as to what people are buying, what items are expensive and for what reason, etc, how much of their money they got from farming.

Right now, I want to farm. I want the option to farm.

BUT I HATE FARMING ALONE. Its BORING.

I show my farming runs to my guildies then we split up....why? Cause theres more money in the amount of time we spent if we went solo each.

Guild Wars SHOULD advocate more group farming and social interaction.

I think SF/Tombs/UW/FOW/DEEP/URGOZ are all great places and we should have more of them and make it so it rewards full groups who make it to the end.

Solo Farming should be made to look "inefficient" and "not worth it".

thats just imo though.

You dont really understand economics do you?

An increase in gold in the market wouldnt just increase prices of green items, or items which people trade themselves.

It would effect the prices are traders for materials and dyes.

You do understand this?

More gold means people buy more materials and more dyes, which means the price shoots up because their is more demand.

More demand = higher prices.
Less demand = lower prices.

Accross the entire game. Not just greens.

bigwig · Oct 29, 2006, 04:45 PM // 16:45

I don't know if people are bothering to actually read the first post, but this is actually a very bad idea.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr_Cynical

First off, this is not a 'the nerf sucks' thread, there are plenty of those. This is a suggestion to solve the dual problem of farming, and farming nerfs, for good.

Why do people farm? Well, because the price of stuff in GW vastly outstrips the gold supply. No, I don't mean the 90k weapons sold by players (the sooner those stupid prices come down the better), I mean the stuff sold by ingame NPCs - FoW, 15k, even 'basic' max armor costs 7.5k per char, which is not trivial to acquire unless you farm.

What is the real problem with the GW game mechanics? Let's take an example. Someone in the Southern Shiverpeaks who forms a team of 8 people (either humans or hench) and goes out and fights packs of monsters as the game was supposed to work, gets an eighth of the drop rate of someone who goes out and solo farms trolls. Anet could solve the real players' (as opposed to bots) motivation for solo farming in a stroke by giving people who play in teams the same drop rates as people who solo (rather than dividing it between the entire team). Solo farming could then be totally and completely nerfed, to stop the goldseller bots I mentioned, and would have the full support of the GW community, rather than the current 'you can only get basic items by farming, but we will nerf all farming' which threatens to destroy a very good game.

So in essence, the drop rate would be increased 8 fold. 8x the drops. This is laughable. This would destroy the economy. Each monster would probably have to drop about 8 things. The very idea of which, makes me laugh. Would this stop bot farming? no. Would this devalue gold? yes. Seriously, this is a terrible idea, and i'm suprised that people come to these threads, never question the ideas, and then *sign* them. people will just sign anything.